Appearing on CNN Tonight, TruthRevolt Editor-In-Chief Ben Shapiro debated Haaretz columnist Peter Beinart in a showdown that turned personal.
On Wednesday, President Barack Obama stated that he had, “no sympathy for Hamas. I have great sympathy for ordinary people who are struggling within Gaza.” He also said that Hamas was acting "extraordinarily irresponsibly" by placing rockets in civilian centers. Beinart agreed with Obama: “He is exactly right. Israel does have the right to defend itself. It also needs some better guarantees against Hamas.”
Beinart then excused Hamas' actions by blaming Israel's treatment of Gaza:
Beinart: But ordinary Palestinians also need some relief from a blockade that has destroyed the Gazan economy and actually helped Hamas. The blockade has destroyed the independent business class in Gaza by making exports virtually impossible. It's made it very difficult for Gazan fishermen to go a few miles out beyond the coast.
Beinart of course makes no mention of the reason for the blockade: Palestinian terror.Nonetheless, he continued.
Beinart: Beyond that being a humanitarian disaster, it actually strengthens Hamas by creating -- strengthening the climate of despair and hatred on which Hamas feeds.
When prompted to respond to UN-provided civilian casualties, Shapiro didn't mince words about the unreliability of the sources:
Shapiro: As far as whose numbers we should trust, I can tell you whose numbers we shouldn't trust, the same people who said that 5,000 people had been killed in Jenin, which was false, or the same people who said that two-thirds of the people killed in Operation Cast Lead in 2008-2009 were civilians, which turned out to be false, or the same people who have put out on Hamas TV that civilians should stick around in all of the buildings surrounding terrorist entities. Those people are probably not the folks that we want to trust in attributing civilian casualties.
Host Aliyson Camerota interjected and asked if it was Hamas or human rights groups putting out the numbers.
Shapiro: I'm talking about human rights groups in Gaza which are working with Hamas and Palestinian authority sources in order to find those numbers. How do they get those numbers in the first place? You heard the fellow from the UN say just a little while ago that they are working with both Palestinian and Israeli sources. The Palestinian sources they are working with on the ground in the Gaza Strip are in large part Hamas, Palestinian Authority or Islamic Jihad sources, who have a great interest in ensuring that the American people and that the rest of the world believe that a huge number of civilians have been killed, which -- it's the same reason why they're putting civilians in front of rockets on a regular basis.
Co-host Jake Tapper then jumped in and switched the topic of conversation, asking who is "responsible for the deaths of these innocent Palestinians?"
Beinart wasted no time and quickly took to blaming Israel and attempting to use the Talmud, a Jewish holy text, as justification:
Beinart: I don't doubt at all that Hamas is pursuing a strategy that is likely to increase civilian casualties from operating from urban areas. I think Israel is bombing an area which is very, very densely populated with some weapons that are not all precision weapons. So it's inevitable that a lot of innocent civilians are going to die. Regardless of the number, the Talmud says whoever destroys a single life, it's as if he destroyed an entire world...What interests me was there a political strategy that could have been pursued against Hamas so that this war would not have been possible? What I find most tragic is that when you have peaceful nonviolent resisters in the West Bank, they are repeatedly imprisoned by Israel. And so Palestinians get the message that in fact nonviolence doesn't work. The real way to weaken Hamas is to show that people who accept Israel's right to exist and pursue their grievances nonviolently. People in villages like Belin and Navi Salah have been doing for a decade now, that they get results. And tragically, this Israeli government has not done that.
Shapiro: The nonsensical idea where that Hamas is firing rockets that somehow they're mad about imprisonments in the West Bank, or they would stop firing rockets if Israel were to release the prisoners it holds, is nonsensical and idiotic. In fact, Israel has just done multiple prisoner releases with regard and that has not seemed to quell anything with Hamas. When Israel pulled out in 2005 and that launched the election of Hamas and further violence.The idea that if Israel makes more and more concessions, that will somehow not embolden Hamas, as opposed to creating a movement against Hamas, that has not been proved by history in any way, shape or form. Peter always finds a way to ensure that Israeli policy is somehow responsible for rockets falling on Israeli cities, when it's really Hamas doing the firing.
Unable to respond, Beinart took to lying about Shapiro’s stated positions and likened the conservative commentator to the radical Islamist terrorist organization Hamas.
Beinart: The irony to me is Ben and Hamas have an enormous amount in common. Hamas doesn't believe that Jews should be allowed to live in the state of Israel. Ben has said that Palestinians don't have the right to live in Israel, West Bank or Gaza, because he's called for physically expelling all of them. So, in fact, the true moral and ideological partners, Ben, are you and Hamas.
Shapiro dismissed the accusation as "absolutely nonsense," as he firmly disavowed any form of population transfer in 2013, and said if there is anyone who is emboldening Hamas, it is Beinart:
Shapiro: To call me morally equivalent with people who are murdering Jews is insanity. It's beyond insulting. and if there is anybody who is emboldening Hamas to kill more children it is you because it is your policies which have emboldened Hamas. They know people like you are going to get on American television, and talk about how the Palestinians are meek victims. And whenever they fire rockets, it can be justified by Israeli policy. Hamas celebrates every time you're on television, Peter.
